2 year old boy grabbed and taken by gator at Grand Floridian

[AuburnJen 777]

My good friend Arthur Lyons (who was very good friends with the brother that was killed years ago btw) was a the Poly Beach watching the MK fireworks (a couple of months ago) and politely went up to some people and told them that splashing and wading in the water was not a good idea because of the gators.  They told him to mind his own business.  I also have been seeing reports from CM's saying that people are actually feeding the gators too.  This usually leads to an attack of an animal or human soon after the feedings begin.  Alligators are never tame.  They usually lose their lives because of humans.  I would hate to think that humans feeding these animals was the cause of this.  It would send me into orbit.  It also maddens me that people would tell someone to mind their own business when they were trying to prevent this very thing from happening.  

[h2odivers...Ray 952]

10 minutes ago, AuburnJen said:

As someone who has grown up in Florida and had a close friend lose a brother to an alligator attack and several friends and neighbors lose dogs to them as well, I know all too well not to be near the water at sunrise or sunset, much less at night.  However, I am not the norm.  I don't think there has ever been a time I have driven near the waterfront at FW and not heard a gator along with the frogs.  Do you need to know what you are listening for?  Yes, you do.  Do I make it my knowledge to know?  Yes, I do.  However, I am not the norm.  Like everyone else has said, Disney gives most people a sense of euphoria where they think reality is somewhere else.  I am guilty of it too.  (i.e. WWW, lol)  I feel so bad for this family and hurt for them.  I wish more people would educate themselves before they come to Florida on the aquatic wildlife, even when they are at the happiest place (swamp) on earth so this will never ever happen to another family again.

Jen I think your 100% correct about people being educated aboit the risks.  

 

I must admit that that before this I wouldn't have thought twice about wading in any lake at wdw. Heck a few years ago we stay at the yacht club and there was a private beach party going on. It was next to the pirate ship slide.  It wa at night when walked by and saw dozen of people wading in the water.   I remember being a little jealous that we couldn't be at the party and in the water. 

 

But it now I know better. 

[Travisma 1,317]

Watching the fireworks and electric water parade from Clemintines Beach, we've seen plenty of kids and adults running around at the edge of the water. Maybe the gators don't hang around there as much because of the boat traffic.  But they are just about everywhere else that there is water.

Just remember there is a lot of "real" wildlife that calls Disney home.

One time approaching the dock at the Contemporary, we saw what looked like a black plastic bag blowing around on the beach, but it was going in different directions.  As we got closer we realized it was a very large otter playing at the waters edge.

I've seen rabbits running around in the bushes at Great Britian at Epcot, then of course the deer, turkeys and gators at the Fort.

And maybe I'm crazy, but I swear I saw a wolf or coyote from the monorail running thru the woods along 7 Seas Lagoon between the Contemporary and the ticket center stop.

[bhall 115]

37 minutes ago, AuburnJen said:

As someone who has grown up in Florida and had a close friend lose a brother to an alligator attack and several friends and neighbors lose dogs to them as well, I know all too well not to be near the water at sunrise or sunset, much less at night.  However, I am not the norm.  I don't think there has ever been a time I have driven near the waterfront at FW and not heard a gator along with the frogs.  Do you need to know what you are listening for?  Yes, you do.  Do I make it my knowledge to know?  Yes, I do.  However, I am not the norm.  Like everyone else has said, Disney gives most people a sense of euphoria where they think reality is somewhere else.  I am guilty of it too.  (i.e. WWW, lol)  I feel so bad for this family and hurt for them.  I wish more people would educate themselves before they come to Florida on the aquatic wildlife, even when they are at the happiest place (swamp) on earth so this will never ever happen to another family again.

Do they make a low rumbling growling noise?  Because one night after working for the bank in the early morning hours, about 3 am in the beginning of March of 2015, I went for a walk in the 300 loop.  About halfway in I heard a very low rumbling growl which sounded like it was to my right.  I was walking counter clockwise.  It didn't quite sound like a dog.  My ball cap had 2 little LEDs under the visor but I couldn't see anything when I swung the light in that direction.  I didn't spend too much time investigating it and walked briskly out of there in case it wasn't a dog.

[Seals 111]

Last summer a teenager with his father was attacked by a bear while he slept in a hammock in the Great Smoky Mountains National Park. That wasn't as surprising to me as this is. In part because I live closer to that area and am more familair with bear sightings and in part because that is solely a natural area.  Some friends stayed at a mountain cabin closer to Gatlinburg and had bears in the driveway.  And still, I let my boys go hiking in the woods with their boy scout troop. I know a lot of people are saying the parents should have known to not go near the water. But as I said before, I can easily see how they didn't even think about it as a possibility.

[bhall 115]

Here's a story and video of the guy who was attacked 30 years ago at Fort Wilderness.

http://www.fox25boston.com/news/nh-child-attacked-by-gator-at-disney-world-30-years-ago/345144911

[Northerngirl--Lori 5]

We were camping at Fort Wilderness when the boy was attacked, October 1986. We heard gun shots, didn't know what was going on. We were told by a cast Member that a boy had been attacked by an alligator. We were told the boy was alright, and the alligator was dead. We use to swim in the lake all the time, never gave a thought about what could of been in the water.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[twiceblessed....nacole 433]

10 hours ago, AuburnJen said:

As someone who has grown up in Florida and had a close friend lose a brother to an alligator attack and several friends and neighbors lose dogs to them as well, I know all too well not to be near the water at sunrise or sunset, much less at night.  However, I am not the norm.  I don't think there has ever been a time I have driven near the waterfront at FW and not heard a gator along with the frogs.  Do you need to know what you are listening for?  Yes, you do.  Do I make it my knowledge to know?  Yes, I do.  However, I am not the norm.  Like everyone else has said, Disney gives most people a sense of euphoria where they think reality is somewhere else.  I am guilty of it too.  (i.e. WWW, lol)  I feel so bad for this family and hurt for them.  I wish more people would educate themselves before they come to Florida on the aquatic wildlife, even when they are at the happiest place (swamp) on earth so this will never ever happen to another family again.

I'm so sorry that your friend lost his brother.  To loose someone you love, in such a horrific way... I simply cannot imagine.  I don't want to imagine.  

On the gators...what noise do they make??!  I had NO idea that you could hear them....

[twiceblessed....nacole 433]

10 hours ago, h2odivers...Ray said:

Jen I think your 100% correct about people being educated aboit the risks.  

 

I must admit that that before this I wouldn't have thought twice about wading in any lake at wdw. Heck a few years ago we stay at the yacht club and there was a private beach party going on. It was next to the pirate ship slide.  It wa at night when walked by and saw dozen of people wading in the water.   I remember being a little jealous that we couldn't be at the party and in the water. 

 

But it now I know better. 

 

10 hours ago, Travisma said:

Watching the fireworks and electric water parade from Clemintines Beach, we've seen plenty of kids and adults running around at the edge of the water. Maybe the gators don't hang around there as much because of the boat traffic.  But they are just about everywhere else that there is water.

Just remember there is a lot of "real" wildlife that calls Disney home.

One time approaching the dock at the Contemporary, we saw what looked like a black plastic bag blowing around on the beach, but it was going in different directions.  As we got closer we realized it was a very large otter playing at the waters edge.

I've seen rabbits running around in the bushes at Great Britian at Epcot, then of course the deer, turkeys and gators at the Fort.

And maybe I'm crazy, but I swear I saw a wolf or coyote from the monorail running thru the woods along 7 Seas Lagoon between the Contemporary and the ticket center stop.

See... and even though I know y'all have seen gators out there and we saw that one last fall (plus that gentleman saying that his buddy was hired to hunt/kill a large gator), I still would have NEVER imagined something like this happening...simple because (in my uneducated mind) I would have thought that the beach areas were too populated and that the gators would stay away.  Honestly, just would have never thought of it.  My heart aches for this family.  And, as Jen mentioned, the thought that maybe people are actually feeding the gators...what??!!  You deserve to be shot.

 

8 hours ago, Northerngirl--Lori said:

We were camping at Fort Wilderness when the boy was attacked, October 1986. We heard gun shots, didn't know what was going on. We were told by a cast Member that a boy had been attacked by an alligator. We were told the boy was alright, and the alligator was dead. We use to swim in the lake all the time, never gave a thought about what could of been in the water.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

When I heard about this sweet baby, my immediate thought was why didn't someone shoot the gator??  But, maybe it happened too fast... or maybe people are afraid to carry. Oh... my heart.  That sweet baby and his sweet, sweet family.  How do you go home without your child.  Sweet Jesus, please bring peace.

[The Troll 67]

I have often seen people wading in the water at Disney and, quite frankly, been very surprised by it. I think it's another case of lax rules enforcement. Disney needs to batten down the hatches on the rules. I know they're a vacation destination and, accordingly, they don't want to put a cloud over anyone's vacation by wagging a finger at them...but...

[Northerngirl--Lori 5]

My heart is breaking for the family. How do you go home without him? How do you go on, you are going to relive the horror forever.. I don't know if I could do it.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[BigTom 76]

19 hours ago, Seals said:

I think this is going to be a hard one for Disney to deal with. There is no such thing as a "freak accident" anymore. Someone or some thing has to have been at fault and be corrected. 

Gators make a deep grunting sound, when mad or disturbed they will hiss, you do not want to hear one hiss because you are too close and they are mad. Gators can run very fast 20mph but only a short distance and usually in one direction, don't think you can outrun one they are very quick. I have lived here for over 70 years and have swam in many lakes, never had a problem with one during the day, but have always heard don't go in water after dark because you don't know what is lurking there. I have seen some over 14 to 15 feet long in places where I have been swimming later. 

[AuburnJen 777]

12 hours ago, bhall said:

Do they make a low rumbling growling noise?  Because one night after working for the bank in the early morning hours, about 3 am in the beginning of March of 2015, I went for a walk in the 300 loop.  About halfway in I heard a very low rumbling growl which sounded like it was to my right.  I was walking counter clockwise.  It didn't quite sound like a dog.  My ball cap had 2 little LEDs under the visor but I couldn't see anything when I swung the light in that direction.  I didn't spend too much time investigating it and walked briskly out of there in case it wasn't a dog.

The adults can when they are are protecting territory.  Yes, you were being warned.  Most of the time I listen for the babies to know where to stay away from because when you hear the adults, it is not a good sign and you are in danger.  You had a guardian angel looking out for you that day.

[AuburnJen 777]

I also have been hearing on the CM threads that I am privileged to that even last week CM's had to get guests away from gators in FW because they actually thought they were animatronic (I probably spelled that wrong) and they wanted to pet the fake gator.  It wasn't fake.

It is a wake up call for Disney for more education but it also should be a wake up call for the general public as well.  Society is being trained to go around with their heads up and locked and everyone and everybody is going to look out for them so they won't get hurt.  Life is not that way.  It just seems like the media wants to dumb everyone down.  I just want to hug this family in my arms and tell them how sorry I am they lost their baby.  I do.  It was a horrible accident. 

[AuburnJen 777]

12 hours ago, bhall said:

Do they make a low rumbling growling noise?  Because one night after working for the bank in the early morning hours, about 3 am in the beginning of March of 2015, I went for a walk in the 300 loop.  About halfway in I heard a very low rumbling growl which sounded like it was to my right.  I was walking counter clockwise.  It didn't quite sound like a dog.  My ball cap had 2 little LEDs under the visor but I couldn't see anything when I swung the light in that direction.  I didn't spend too much time investigating it and walked briskly out of there in case it wasn't a dog.

My dad has a pipe that goes out into his pond out back that feeds his sprinkler system.  We all know when mating season is for gators, it is taught very early to us in school in science class.  He, many times, has to come home from work at sunset because of his job.  The pipe gets mud and muck stuck in it from time to time and the pump will lose its prime.  When he has to go out at sunrise or sunset to wade out in the water, there is several of us on watch to look for gators.  He gets a visit from the local turtles and fish of course, and that is all fine and good, but I have a 120 pound dog who likes to bark at them and even I know he is no match for a gator.  However, he is a good retriever and will go get my dad and help if necessary and alerts us much quicker than we see things.  

This is not a usual occurrence I am sure if you are not from the southern states and not near a body of water.  But, if you come to the southern states, it is something you need to know.  If you are near the edge of a body of water during sunrise, sunset, or at night, you had better know your surroundings or if you don't, you don't need to be there.

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

Quote

Update on watercraft service around the Magic Kingdom resort area

2 hours ago

The Magic Kingdom Ferry Boat service has resumed operation between the Magic Kingdom and the Transportation and Ticket Center.

Other watercraft on both Bay Lake and Seven Seas Lagoon remain out of service.

All Walt Disney World Resort hotel beach areas and recreational marinas continue to be closed.

 

http://www.wdwmagic.com/resorts/walt-disney-world-resorts-information/news/16jun2016-update-on-watercraft-service-around-the-magic-kingdom-resort-area.htm

[AuburnJen 777]

This may help those of you who are unfamiliar with alligators.

http://srelherp.uga.edu/alligators/alligator-safety.htm

[twiceblessed....nacole 433]

Thanks Jen, that is helpful.

 

The more I've thought about the last few posts, the more this continues to upset me.  I'll preface this by saying, that I believe that people in our country are much too quick to sue. Seems like everyone sues, for any little reason... and often they get something out of it, as it's easier and cheaper than fighting.  It's irritating. 

However... it's really starting to sound as though Disney knew that they were having a problem with gators getting close to the public.  My heart aches for this family and maybe I'm just trying to find blame so anger can be focused... but IF this could have been prevented, by Disney being more vigilant... mercy, I have no words.  If posting signs, handing out flyers at guests check in and/or hiring a CM to simply monitor each beach area for guests during not only the day, but night... if that could have prevented this, then...

 

 

[lightbikes 73]

36 minutes ago, twiceblessed....nacole said:

Thanks Jen, that is helpful.

 

The more I've thought about the last few posts, the more this continues to upset me.  I'll preface this by saying, that I believe that people in our country are much too quick to sue. Seems like everyone sues, for any little reason... and often they get something out of it, as it's easier and cheaper than fighting.  It's irritating. 

However... it's really starting to sound as though Disney knew that they were having a problem with gators getting close to the public.  My heart aches for this family and maybe I'm just trying to find blame so anger can be focused... but IF this could have been prevented, by Disney being more vigilant... mercy, I have no words.  If posting signs, handing out flyers at guests check in and/or hiring a CM to simply monitor each beach area for guests during not only the day, but night... if that could have prevented this, then...

 

 

I agree with you - Disney has likely known for awhile that the gators were getting too close for comfort but the question likely is one of image.  How does the "happiest place on earth" say "oh by the way we have a gator problem and you have to be paying attention to your surroundings".  The two images likely don't line up from a publicity/public image perspective.  Disney doesn't want anything to tar the image of WDW as a place of carefree fun.  Warning people that they can be attacked by a gator, particularly more so at breeding time conflicts with that message.  

My hubby reminded me yesterday evening when he was reading this tread about how many times he's been golfing, especially on the Palm course, and there are gators in the rough and even up on the greens.  It wouldn't be any much wonder that some guests might mistakenly think that because these things wander everywhere the ones at WDW are somehow "tamer" than the ones in the wild.  

2 hours ago, AuburnJen said:

This is not a usual occurrence I am sure if you are not from the southern states and not near a body of water.  But, if you come to the southern states, it is something you need to know.  If you are near the edge of a body of water during sunrise, sunset, or at night, you had better know your surroundings or if you don't, you don't need to be there.

I also agree with this - those of us who come from the North aren't familiar with gators and we need someone to give us a sharp rap upside our heads about them.  

However we are familiar with other wildlife (bears, wolves, snakes, all sorts of things) and we need to remember that just because we are at WDW we still need to pay attention and understand that there are hazards everywhere.  

Having said all that this still remains a tragedy for the family involved.

[Beckers 1,136]

some people seem to think that because it a was a "man made lake" it shouldn't have anything living in it. I don't know if they think it's just a giant swimming pool or what. 

 

I don't know what the answer is on how to prevent this from taking place again. I don't see it being possible to remove and prevent alligators from entering the lagoon . 

[AuburnJen 777]

8 minutes ago, Beckers said:

some people seem to think that because it a was a "man made lake" it shouldn't have anything living in it. I don't know if they think it's just a giant swimming pool or what. 

 

I don't know what the answer is on how to prevent this from taking place again. I don't see it being possible to remove and prevent alligators from entering the lagoon . 

It isn't possible.  That isn't reality.  I have seen where gators climb fences, they will go anywhere to get to a source of water, man made or God made.  They are the alpha predator of the food chain.  Disney was built on a swamp.  These are facts.  Just in the past few weeks this video of a monster gator vent viral that he walked a golf course during the day and everyone I talked to thought it was cute that was not a native of Florida.  The Floridians all said, I bet no one goes around there sunrise, sunset or at night or you wouldn't see them again.  Gators are not cute.

There is something to be said of Disney's policy on what is seen and what is not.  Obviously their policy of removing gators that are 5 feet or larger has to be revisited.  However, doing so is going to be a daunting task for the FWC and Disney itself.  

The people who say that because it is a man-made lake shouldn't have anything living in it are showing just how uneducated they really are I am sorry to say.  In Florida, if there is water, there are wildlife.  

It may happen again if people continue to feed the wildlife, including the gators, which I still believe is the cause of this horrible tragedy.  No one will ever be able to prove it, but if you ever catch someone feeding gators at Disney, I hope you go after them with everything you have, because I know I will.  I have seen what happens when people feed gators.  It never, ever turns out well for anyone and the gator always loses its life.

[Tri-Circle-D 2,059]

1 hour ago, twiceblessed....nacole said:

The more I've thought about the last few posts, the more this continues to upset me.  I'll preface this by saying, that I believe that people in our country are much too quick to sue. Seems like everyone sues, for any little reason... and often they get something out of it, as it's easier and cheaper than fighting.  It's irritating. 

However... it's really starting to sound as though Disney knew that they were having a problem with gators getting close to the public.  My heart aches for this family and maybe I'm just trying to find blame so anger can be focused... but IF this could have been prevented, by Disney being more vigilant... mercy, I have no words.  If posting signs, handing out flyers at guests check in and/or hiring a CM to simply monitor each beach area for guests during not only the day, but night... if that could have prevented this, then...

I am the first to point the finger at the Disney corporation when it does something wrong, but I don't think it's fair to point the finger here.

Look at what Disney did when the thought there was a threat of bears at Fort Wilderness.  They spent a lot of $$$ to install bear-proof trash cans.

If a hurricane is heading toward the Fort, they will evacuate the entire campground and pay for guests to stay in hotels at no additional charge.

Someone drowned in one of the quiet pools at Pop Century Resort, and ever since, they have been installing fences around their pools, and have lifeguards on duty where they never have before.

Before that, they filled in the deep ends of all the pools property wide.

All the playground equipment at the Fort was replaced with modern, safer versions.

They installed doors on all of the parking lot trams to protect careless guests from themselves.

I can't think of many companies that put such an effort into safety.

There is no way that they would knowingly expose any guest to an alligator attack.

This was an unforeseeable and tragic accident.

TCD

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

33 minutes ago, Tri-Circle-D said:

This was an unforeseeable and tragic accident.

TCD

I tend to agree. Sad, terrible, awful things happen, and while I understand the reaction of wanting someone to blame, sometimes there is no one person or thing to point the finger at.

[Cortezcapt (Derek) 156]

Sadly I don't think there anyone or thing to place the blame one. This was a tragic accident, it could have and has happened to anyone anywhere there are gators.

Growing up in Florida around lakes, the beach, and in the country one learns about all the things that can get you in Florida. Where to look, what to do and not to do, where to go and not go.

We used to spend every thanksgiving at a campground on lake Okeechobee there was a beach and we would swim when it was warm enough. One year I remember a cotton mouth swimming 8 or 9 yards from us, we stayed out of his way he stayed out of ours and we kept an eye on him till he was gone. A few years later when we went back the had closed the beach because a girl had been attacked by a gator. Multiple generations grew up swimming in the river here out in the middle of nowhwere, you could canoe the river and see gator but that didn't stop anyone. Now there was almost always a group and loud and obnoxious. Gators tend to stay away unless the are being fed or protecting there nest or young, but there is always the chance.

Unfortunately Florida gets a lot of out of state or foreign visitors who don't know what to do, avoid, or look for. When I ran a sightseeing boat we would stop at a sand bar and let people off to swim. I always told people what to look out for, to shuffle their feet and so on, things locals do without even thinking about it, if your snorkeling or swimming take your sparkling jewelry off just incase there happens to be barracuda around.

I grew up hunting and fishing and was taught to respect wildlife and treat everything thing as wild. The animals can't be blamed (though they usually are) and it's easy to put the blame on the person or family but most people don't think about things like wildlife.

I think a letter from Disney that went out to every person that checked in stating what kind of wildlife may be encountered on property and that all animals should be treated as wild and their space respected might help those that aren't aware of Florida wildlife be more vigilant and better prepared. Maybe even educational signs by the beach or somewhere in the resorts showing the types of wildlife and a short description of them. It would help people be aware of what is around them without screaming "stop, this thing might eat you". Many state parks and rest areas in Florida have signs or something showing poisonous snakes and other things to look out for.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

1 minute ago, Cortezcapt (Derek) said:

I think a letter from Disney that went out to every person that checked in stating what kind of wildlife may be encountered on property and that all animals should be treated as wild and their space respected might help those that aren't aware of Florida wildlife be more vigilant and better prepared. Maybe even educational signs by the beach or somewhere in the resorts showing the types of wildlife and a short description of them.

I expect they'll do that in the very least.  And while it's not possible to fence off every lake and canal on property, I'd also expect some sort of barriers will be put in place on all the beaches to keep people out of the water altogether - which is probably a lot easier than keeping the wildlife away.