Good article on MB's and FP+

[ImDownWithDisney 342]

http://www.wired.com/2015/03/disney-magicband/

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

That's probably the most in-depth article I've seen - not just on how MBs work, but how the idea came about in the first place.

 

Thanks for sharing it.

[GaDawgFan.....Kelly 799]

Interesting. I might just have to share that with my favorite nerd. 

[DaveInTN 3,247]

 

 

The MagicBand contains sensors that let guests swipe onto rides and allow Disney to pinpoint their location. At Be Our Guest, they’re what enable the radios in the table and ceiling to triangulate your location so your server can find you. If Disney decides to install those sensors throughout the park, a new world of data opens up. They could have Mickey and Snow White find you. 

 

:panic:

[mouseketab.....Carol 1,261]

So THAT's what was going on behind Mickey's former greeting spot, interesting. There was rumors that was going to be the location of the Monster's Inc. doors coaster.

[Tri-Circle-D 2,059]

There is a ton of misinformation in that article.

 

Like this:

 

 It begins when you book your ticket online and pick your favorite rides. Disney’s servers crunch your preferences, then neatly package them into an itinerary calculated to keep the route between stops from being a slog—or a frustrating zig-zag back and forth across the park.

 

What a crock. There is no mention in the article of the fact that guests are limited to three FP+ choices per day, and those must be in the same park, and that two of the parks have tiered choices which restrict guests to only being able to choose one headline attraction.  And since when does Disney plan it out for you so you have a smooth route in the parks?  How convenient is it to hunt down a FP+ kiosk and wait in line there so you can potentially save a ten minute wait to ride the teacups?

 

then we have this:

 

By getting people exploring beyond the park’s top attractions, overall use of the park goes up. People spend less time in line. They’re doing more, which means they’re spending more and remembering more.

 

Here we have it. This is what the geniuses who cooked up this billion dollar fiasco thought they could deliver.  The result is quite the opposite.  Guests clearly spend more time in line under the new system than they ever did under the old.  These non top level attractions which used to be accessible with no or very short lines now have lines of 30+ minutes.  Did anyone ever have to wait 30+ minutes to ride Spaceship Earth before FP+?

 

There are some enlightening things about Disney's corporate though process revealed in the article.  Like this:

 

In fact, it’s called the paradox of choice: You make people happier not by giving them more options but by stripping away as many as you can. The redesigned Disney World experience constrains choices by dispersing them, beginning long before the trip is under way.

 

Huh?  Are they saying that guests were too stupid to plan their own vacations, so Disney stepped in to do it for them?  And we are supposed to be happy about that?

 

and, finally, we have this:

 

“It lets people’s vacations unfold naturally,” Staggs says. “The ability to plan and personalize has given way to spontaneity.” And that feeling of ease, and whatever flows from it, just might make you more apt to come back.

 

That says all I need to know.  The head idiot thinks that the new system somehow promotes spontaneity.  I guess when he flies in on the corporate jet, he doesn't have to worry about things like scheduling his measly three FP+'s per day 60 days out or his dining reservation 6 months out.  I'm sure it's great for him.  What a clueless idiot.

 

 

TCD

[Avatab.... Steve 124]

 

There are some enlightening things about Disney's corporate though process revealed in the article.  Like this:

 

In fact, it’s called the paradox of choice: You make people happier not by giving them more options but by stripping away as many as you can. The redesigned Disney World experience constrains choices by dispersing them, beginning long before the trip is under way.

 

Huh?  Are they saying that guests were too stupid to plan their own vacations, so Disney stepped in to do it for them?  And we are supposed to be happy about that?

 

and, finally, we have this:

 

“It lets people’s vacations unfold naturally,” Staggs says. “The ability to plan and personalize has given way to spontaneity.” And that feeling of ease, and whatever flows from it, just might make you more apt to come back.

 

That says all I need to know.  The head idiot thinks that the new system somehow promotes spontaneity.  I guess when he flies in on the corporate jet, he doesn't have to worry about things like scheduling his measly three FP+'s per day 60 days out or his dining reservation 6 months out.  I'm sure it's great for him.  What a clueless idiot.

 

 

TCD

 

Disney is reflecting a generational change in America. Seems like the newer generations are much more willing to have a larger "authority" take away choices as long as they will make the decisions for them.  And you have an insulated elite more than happy to make those choices for us in spite of the fact that they don't know what the hell they are doing..........

[The Troll 67]

Dropping my Troll gimmick for a bit, I wanted to comment on the article. I enjoyed the article very much and I think it's very well written and interesting. How they developed the system and made it work are fascinating.

 

I am very "pro corporation," if you will, and am very much for Disney making record profits, so long as they don't cheapen the product or leave me feeling I didn't get my money's worth. Yes, you pay more at Disney and I joke about it A LOT, but bottom line is this: It's worth it. I love the damned place and just about everything about it and am willing to fork over the extra cash to continue experiencing it.

 

With that in mind, I'm trying to look at the Magic Band system objectively.

 

TCD makes very strong points. The big one, I think, is breaking the rides into tiers and then limiting you to one "main event" ride per day. I am also very suspicious and displeased with the long gaps that are scheduled in between rides. I think when the author of the article wrote this: Disney’s servers crunch your preferences, then neatly package them into an itinerary calculated to keep the route between stops from being a slog—or a frustrating zig-zag back and forth across the park, I'm with TCD. I think this is propaganda for, "We're programming in big waits in between rides to deliberately leave you with nothing to do but eat and shop."

 

Let's face it: The Magic Band doesn't give you any "itinerary," and how does scheduling you for the Hall of Presidents at 4:15 and Splash Mountain at 6:30 save anyone from zigzagging?

 

Heck, while I'm at it, what's with that, "Disney servers crunch your preferences" tripe? That system doesn't know anything about my preferences. It just pops a generic list of available rides on my laptop and says, "Pick three, bitch."

 

And this makes no sense: In fact, it’s called the paradox of choice: You make people happier not by giving them more options but by stripping away as many as you can. This construct can certainly be true in, say, the restaurant business, but it runs counter to the Disney culture. The whole point of Disney World is its vast array of choices. You don't have to go anywhere else because we've got everything you want right here. I really suspect this is more propaganda for, "The rides are too crowded. So to fix that, we're going to let people just ride three. The rest of their time, they can spend in shops and our delightful eateries."

 

Now to be fair, I do think the problem of guests gobbling up the Fast Passes at rope drop had to be fixed. Casual and/or first-time guests would show up later in the day, only to find signature attractions had already run out of Fast Passes by 1PM for the entire day. On top of that was the problem of "hacking" the Fast Pass system. While I admit I may have been guilty of that myself once or twice in the past, overall, it was bad for the system, from park management's perspective.

 

Bottom line -- So far, for me, the Magic Band is a lot of technology for the sake of technology. It really doesn't make anything much easier or faster. So it has my debit card number on it. So what? Whipping out my debit card took me, what, three seconds? Personally, I believe the Magic Band destroys the concept of "Let's do it all!" days at a given park. You just can't do that anymore unless you're willing to endure the standby lines. Instead, Leslie and I book a "main event" ride, pop into the park, ride it, maybe eat a snack or sit in a rocking chair, then pop out. I would expect a lot of annual passholders like us are doing the same. And isn't that defeating the very intent of the Magic Band to begin with?

[Tri-Circle-D 2,059]

That's a great post, Norm.  I mean Troll.

 

MagicBands are a billion dollar plus solution to an undefined problem that didn't exist in the first place.

 

It boggles my mind that they spent so much money on something that accomplishes very little, and that doesn't even work very well at doing that.

 

TCD

[The Troll 67]

 

It boggles my mind that they spent so much money on something that accomplishes very little, and that doesn't even work very well at doing that.

 

 

 

Agree. Let's see if we can get into their heads. Let's look at this from a senior park manager's perspective. Here are the goals I could see them having for the system. Keep in mind, these goal must promise a $1 billion ROI, at a minimum:

 

• Fix the Fast Pass gobble-up. First-time guests unable to ride signature rides equals many never-to-return guests

   

• Keep people in the parks but out of the attractions. Let's face it -- you're not spending money while sitting in the Hall of Presidents. So let the guests ride some rides, but not too many. Spread ride times out to keep people in the park (and away from their hotel rooms or campsite), waiting for their ride reservations

   

• Forcibly steer people toward less popular attractions. By forcing people to less popular attractions, you increase ridership and have to replace attractions less frequently

   

• Spread the "main event" wealth. With the Fast Pass system, I could conceivably get a Fast Past for Splash Mountain, Big Thunder, and Space Mountain all in the same day, hogging Passes from other guests. Now, instead, I get Splash, Hall of Presidents, and Buzz Lightyear

   

• Steer guests to bigger merchandise rides. That is, some rides like "Pooh" are bigger merchandise movers than rides like, say, Astro Orbiter. So when lines at the merchandise-movers are thin, steer people toward them rather than the slower-movers. Make sure the merchandise-movers are filled up before making the slower-movers available. Simply bamboozle the public by calling this marketing ploy an attempt to  "customize the guest's experience according to his/her preferences."

Then I sense maybe there was yet another goal. I think they suspect there's something big to be gained by them linking the guest's credit/debit card to the band. At first I dismissed it as being mostly a wash, since it's almost just as easy for me to whip out my debit card as it is to use my band. But is there a psychology they're trying to defeat? That is, do they suspect guests will psychologically spend more credit money using the band rather than their actual credit card? Do they predict the band will psychologically "trick" the guest into thinking that all the money their spending isn't really real?

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

One incredibly valuable thing Disney gains with MBs is information.  MBs give Disney the ability to track Guest movement and spending with a pretty great level of detail.  Knowledge is power, especially when it comes to marketing, and Disney is nothing if not a master of marketing.

 

The information MBs gather over time will give Disney detailed insight they'll be able to use for all kinds of future plans from the development of attractions, to merchandising, to dining, to accommodations, to even further manipulating and fine tuning the flow of Guests to and through the parks and attractions.

 

Most companies would kill for that kind of information on their customer base. 

[WannaBeImagineer 98]

Great posts Troll!
 

One incredibly valuable thing Disney gains with MBs is information.  MBs give Disney the ability to track Guest movement and spending with a pretty great level of detail.  Knowledge is power, especially when it comes to marketing, and Disney is nothing if not a master of marketing.
 
The information MBs gather over time will give Disney detailed insight they'll be able to use for all kinds of future plans from the development of attractions, to merchandising, to dining, to accommodations, to even further manipulating and fine tuning the flow of Guests to and through the parks and attractions.
 
Most companies would kill for that kind of information on their customer base.

I fully agree Mo, I was actually about to post something very similar.  I'm assuming at some big meeting someone said if only we could tract the guests more accurately we could be more efficient, so they went out and found a solution. 

 

Plus you know the salesperson pushed other ideas that MB's could be used for that will create an even more personalized experience in the parks and resorts.  Think about the food arriving at your table at BOG, how long before they can great you by name or project your ride picture on the castle because they know you're in the crowd.  I feel with this technology there has to be more they are planning to do with it.

 

WBI

[DaveInTN 3,247]

do they suspect guests will psychologically spend more credit money using the band rather than their actual credit card? 

 

Yes.  

 

I have a Holiday Mickey popcorn bucket sitting in my laundry room that proves this theory.  

[CCIntrigue...aka Gwen 547]

 

Then I sense maybe there was yet another goal. I think they suspect there's something big to be gained by them linking the guest's credit/debit card to the band. At first I dismissed it as being mostly a wash, since it's almost just as easy for me to whip out my debit card as it is to use my band. But is there a psychology they're trying to defeat? That is, do they suspect guests will psychologically spend more credit money using the band rather than their actual credit card? Do they predict the band will psychologically "trick" the guest into thinking that all the money their spending isn't really real?

 

And this is the main reason I don't link my debit card.  

[Tri-Circle-D 2,059]

Then I sense maybe there was yet another goal. I think they suspect there's something big to be gained by them linking the guest's credit/debit card to the band. At first I dismissed it as being mostly a wash, since it's almost just as easy for me to whip out my debit card as it is to use my band. But is there a psychology they're trying to defeat? That is, do they suspect guests will psychologically spend more credit money using the band rather than their actual credit card? Do they predict the band will psychologically "trick" the guest into thinking that all the money their spending isn't really real?

 

I have no doubt that increased revenue was one of the major goals of the geniuses who cooked up this idea.

 

This quote from Staggs is telling:

 

Will the world at large ever become something akin to Disney World, loaded with sensors attuned to our every move, designed to free us? There are signs. It’s already starting to appear on Disney cruise ships, and Staggs says airlines, sports leagues, and sports teams have asked about the technology. “We’re just at the beginning of understanding what to do with this,” he says.

 

These morons decided to spend over a billion dollars on an experiment to ostensibly address problems that detracted from the guest experience.  Instead, they have created a new set of problems, and are tinkering with their billion dollar toy trying to make it do something worthwhile.

 

So stupid.

 

TCD

[The Troll 67]

These morons decided to spend over a billion dollars on an experiment to ostensibly address problems that detracted from the guest experience.  Instead, they have created a new set of problems, and are tinkering with their billion dollar toy trying to make it do something worthwhile.

 

So stupid.

 

TCD

 

Bam! Exactly! That's exactly what I'm driving at. From my own cursory analysis of the Magic Band system, I can't see how it on the outset justifies a $1 billion investment. In my mind, I've been telling myself, "They HAVE to have a bigger plan...a more solid plan..." otherwise it's much to do about nothing and a waste of a billion dollars.

 

And you know what? I think you're right. They're not really sure what the hell they have and are just now trying to figure out how the thing is going to make money.

 

I get that it will track merchandise sales. I get that. But you know what? Think about it -- they already had that. Every time you buy a B'rer Rabbit at the Briar Patch gift shop, the sale, how much the guest spent, the time of the sale, etc., is already captured by their already-existing automated POS systems. It gets entered into a database by the retail clerk as you check out and then can be queried any way they want. They've had that technology, I'm sure, since the late 80s.

 

So that's a wash.

 

Now, a point can be made that the band tracks guest movement very accurately. But aside from actively spamming me pictures of Leslie and me on Splash Mountain for sale in my email after my trip or maybe annoyingly while we're trying to eat dinner at 'Ohana, I don't see what much there is to gain from it.

 

And all that hoohah about being able to welcome a guest by name as they approach the hostess stand...please.

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

I get that it will track merchandise sales. I get that. But you know what? Think about it -- they already had that. Every time you buy a B'rer Rabbit at the Briar Patch gift shop, the sale, how much the guest spent, the time of the sale, etc., is already captured by their already-existing automated POS systems.

 

Ah but it's now much more extensive than that.  With MDE they can not only track your spending on every bottle of water, Mickey bar and t-shirt, they can also track your touring patterns through the parks, how many people are in your party (and who they are), how much time you spend in your room vs parks, which attractions you prefer... pretty much every single thing that funnels through MBs and your MDE account.  That's way more powerful information than just tracking spending alone. 

 

And since all that information is now funneled into a single concentrated database/application that we all are now more and more dependent on, it gives Disney the ability to make recommendations that may help them change traffic patterns or buying habits, as well as customize/personalize experiences and at least give the perception of the Guest getting "more".  And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

 

I can see where the possibilities really are just about limitless for this, with future advantages for Guests and Disney, depending on where they decide to take it.

 

Ok they're not quite there yet, but it expect it won't be long now. 

 

I also think that the MDE we see today will be very different in a year or 2 - not just in terms of working more of the kinks out (and there are still plenty) but in terms of Disney deciding on the next direction to take it in.

[Tri-Circle-D 2,059]

Those are nice thoughts Mo, but you know as well as anyone how awful the implementation and execution of MyDisneyMagic has been.

 

I can't think of one trip I've taken since this mess was rolled out that some aspect of the technology did not fail.

 

We have had reservations mysteriously disappear then reappear, we have had times (many of them) where we could not access the MDE app from the parks, and where the whole system crashed.  We have had many MB's that failed to open our resort room doors, and we all know how well the MB's work at the Fort.  I am getting rather tired of being told that my magic band is blank after a scanner turns blue at an attraction, and having to take out my phone to show a CM that I actually have a FP+ for the ride.  How is that magical?

 

For the money they spent, it would be nice if the stupid thing at least worked reliably.

 

TCD

[lightbikes 73]

Thanks everyone -

 

I was as p@SS@D of as it was possible to be about the blasted bands before reading this - now all I can see is 'big brother' and all I can think of is that TV show on these days called "Person of Interest"  =    DISNEY IS WATCHING ME!!!!!

 

And I have to agree = it's all about grabbing as much of my cash out of my wallet as they can - my "experience" be damned!

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

Those are nice thoughts Mo, but you know as well as anyone how awful the implementation and execution of MyDisneyMagic has been.

 

Oh I won't argue that at all.  Intentions are one thing, implementation is another.

 

I do think that whatever the original rollout intentions were, the project got out of hand pretty quickly, and badly in some cases.  Given the scope of the project that's not really all that surprising.  Very few projects like this ever roll out perfectly even on a much, much smaller scale - and remember, Disney is still calling this the "testing" phase. 

 

The difference of course is that this *is* Disney and the Guest expectations for anything they do are huge - unrealistic in a lot of cases.  Disney Guests aren't used to being Beta testers, and given that they didn't have a choice in the matter, and that in some cases it's impacting the vacations they're paying good money for, the angry reactions aren't a surprise at all - and shouldn't have been for Disney either.

 

The things I mentioned are all possibilities for down the road - possibly WAY down the road, and even then, only if Disney decides to take things in those directions.

 

But I'd be willing to bet those things were also all part of the justifications put before the board for why they should agree to cough up the $1B on this insanely hugh project in the first place.  I don't think we've seen even a fraction of where MDE/MBs will go down the road, and I'd be willing to bet that the presentation put together to justify it included a TON of stuff on all sides of the equation - marketing (read $), Guest experience, information... the whole kit and kaboodle.  Time will tell how much, if any of that we'll actually see materialize.

[Family of Bears 98]

Can we discuss something that everyone seems to have missed...the troll thing is a gimmick?!

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

Can we discuss something that everyone seems to have missed...the troll thing is a gimmick?!

 

:rofl2:

[DaveInTN 3,247]

Can we discuss something that everyone seems to have missed...the troll thing is a gimmick?!

 

I noticed that.  It almost made me come clean and admit that I still love Disney.  

[PGHFiend 140]

I thought the article was pretty good, and basically told us everything you knew Disney was going to do with the info.  I thought the Paradox of choice was a neat angle for them and it makes sense.  The theory is that when you have a lot of things to choose from, say 31 flavors of Ice cream, you are excited by your selection, then immediately saddened by the fact that you didn't choose another flavor.  For Disney to look at the rides and attractions like this is really cool, and similar to the way that Walt designed the resorts so you can't see any resort from any other- to keep you from feeling sad you're not staying at the resort you see from the room you're sitting in.  I always thought the feeling of seclusion when looking off the beach of the Fort was a really amazing feature to have engineered into the experience 50 years ago.  

I see Walt being happy about that idea. 

[AC in A2......Aaron 693]

I can sum up MBs and MDE thusly:

It sucks more than a Kardashian......................