Okay... let's talk DOG.

[twiceblessed....nacole 433]

First, in case anyone wondered... I don't believe there is a (number) limit when it comes to dogs at the Fort.  When were were there earlier this month, we saw two girls in a pop-up with six dogs... 4 of those dogs were 100lbs and over.  Now, all the dogs seemed really well behaved but I still have to say... that's a lot of dog :)

 

 

On a different note, I need advise from you dog owners.  Here's the story:

 

Over the past 9 years, I have been "confronted" by 3 aggressive dogs (one of which took a bite out of my pants... praise God it was just my pants).  So, I now have a fear of dogs and the problem is, I have passed this fear onto my children...especially my daughter who is VERY, VERY afraid of dogs.  ALL DOGS.  I am not afraid of small dogs or any dog that is on a leash with it's owner.  I have shown my children that, with an owner's permission, it is okay to pet a dog however, my daughter hoovers in fear and will (literally) run away from a dog even though her father and I have told her over and over that a) most dogs are nice, we will protect her from a mean dog but that c) we can only protect her if she DOES NOT RUN.   Still, she is TERRIFIED of dogs.  This past weekend we were at a festival and an owner had a extra small chihuahua on a leash.  The thing was the size of a kitten and super cute, but because it was hyper...she would not go come near it.  She tells us that she doesn't want a dog to jump on her or lick her, but I don't believe that not wanting those things would bring about fear.  Irritation, yes (which I get because I am not a "dog person" and I don't want them jumping/licking me), but fear.. no.

 

So my question is, any thoughts on how to help her?  We live in the Atlanta area and I've thought about finding some sort of rescue where maybe I can volunteer with her...but then I wonder if a shelter is really the best place to get over a fear of dogs (as I'm guessing that a lot of the animals lack training and could possibly be aggressive... or at best hyper?).  I'm at a loss.  I'm not concerned if our daughter (who is almost becomes a person who loves dogs...but I don't want her to to be afraid either.  Our son is apprehensive... but not afraid.  He will pet a dog if he sees mommy petting the animal.

[BuckeyeFortFan 35]

I do not know if it is an option, but you guys should get a puppy.  Our second daughter was deathly afraid of all animals when she was 3 or 4.  So we got a puppy.  A cute little boxer pup.  At first she would climb the walls when we put him on the floor when she was in the room, but within a week or two she calmed down and is now our biggest animal lover.

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

I wouldn't go the shelter/rescue route for this.  You need to be sure that any and all dogs your daughter interacts with is absolutely, positively friendly and LOVES children (not just tolerates them).  The crucial thing is that you have to be sure that ALL her interactions with dogs are positive.  Don't take any chances.  If you don't know the dog well yourself, don't take a chance.  Any negative interactions at this point are only going to reinforce her fears more and more.

 

I'd say your best bet is to find a friend or family member that you trust who has a very well behaved, well trained dog, and really and truly knows their dog and their dog's behavior well. Set up some times where your daughter can just go and hang out with the dog around, without any pressure to have to interact.

 

If you can find a good dog that likes to play ball, even better, as your daughter can interact with the dog without actually having to touch or get super close.

 

Let her go at whatever pace is comfortable for her.  Encourage her, try and make the interactions as fun as you can, but don't push. It may take time. It may take a lot of time.  But the hope is that the more good dogs she is exposed to, the more she'll start to realize they're not so scary.

 

Good luck!!

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

If she's expressed really strong feelings about being jumped on or licked, a puppy may not be the best idea as most puppies are mostly bouncing and licking. 

 

And if her fears don't subside, you're now left with what to do with the puppy. 

[momof3kids-Yvonne 596]

My oldest daughter was terrified of dogs. Her heart would start racing when there was one nearby and she would be shivering in fear. She would not go into a room if a dog was there and if it was possible she would want to go in a different direction if we were outside and saw one.

I asked her pediatrician about it and he asked her some general questions. He also asked me if her fear prevented her from leaving the house. It did not. This was a good thing as it showed that her fear was not too extreme and could be worked through. He suggested some type of reward if she petted a dog. However this had to be done completely on her own. We could not force it. He said the reward should be something that would mean a lot to her. We never had to go the reward route as she outgrew her fear as she got older.

She is still cautious around dogs, but no longer fearful. In fact now she often talks about how cute they are and how she wants one.

[Katman1356...Jason 1,140]

It sounds like she needs to spend time with Jedi. I swear there isn't a child alive who doesn't fall in love with him

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

He suggested some type of reward if she petted a dog. However this had to be done completely on her own. We could not force it. He said the reward should be something that would mean a lot to her.

 

That all makes perfect sense.  The goal is to change the association the person has to the thing s/he has a negative association with.  Desensitization (spending time with good dogs without pressure) and counter conditioning (the reward part) are usually the most effective ways to do this without risking increasing the fears or even possibly creating new ones.

 

BTW, it works for dogs too. 

[Beckers 1,136]

It sounds like she needs to spend time with Jedi. I swear there isn't a child alive who doesn't fall in love with him

Or old lady who has been bitten by a dog before and is not a dog fan...

[Tri-Circle-D 2,059]

I don't have an answer for you, but I hope you find a solution.

 

When my daughters would have friends over to the house there would occasionally be one who was "afraid of dogs."  That person is the one whom our dog would give the most attention to.  That was never fun for anyone involved, especially the dog.

 

TCD

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

When my daughters would have friends over to the house there would occasionally be one who was "afraid of dogs."  That person is the one whom our dog would give the most attention to. 

 

It's really weird how that works.  I once had a landlady that was petrified of cats.  Every time she came into my apartment my cat would make a beeline for her and rub all up against her.

[momof3kids-Yvonne 596]

It sounds like she needs to spend time with Jedi. I swear there isn't a child alive who doesn't fall in love with him

Truthfully this would not have worked with Rachel. No matter how lovable and gentle the dog was the fear was still there.

[Katman1356...Jason 1,140]

Or old lady who has been bitten by a dog before and is not a dog fan...

 

Your Mom doesnt like dogs either? I never would have guessed based on her interaction with Jedi. 

 

He is definitely a hit with the senior ladies that live in the manor where Grandma lives. 

[Katman1356...Jason 1,140]

Truthfully this would not have worked with Rachel. No matter how lovable and gentle the dog was the fear was still there.

 

Entirely possible. The great thing about Jedi is he seems to read people well and gives them as much space as they need. He's never been one to run to the person who wants nothing to do with him. Our cat doesnt care if you like cats. You WILL pet her. 

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

Truthfully this would not have worked with Rachel. No matter how lovable and gentle the dog was the fear was still there.

 

That's where the "no pressure" part needs to come into play.

 

They key to desensitization is to keep below the stress/reaction level.  That might mean that to start, the person can only tolerate seeing a dog at a distance (possibly a very great distance).  Once the person is comfortable at that distance (which might take a good bit of time) you get closer, but not so close that they are uncomfortable.

 

Fearful reactions are tough to change and pushing the process can just end up making things worse.

[Mtnmanky...aka Leon 72]

One possiblity is to talk to someone at a local chapter of therapy dogs international.

They provide dogs (and other animals) with their owner/trainers opportuinties to visit hospitals, nursing homes, etc to let the patients interact with the dogs for therapy.  While what you describe is not really theirfocus, they probably know someone in their group who could work with you.  Their dogs are carefully screened and trained.  They have local chapters around the country, and there are other similar groups you can find with a search for therapy dogs. 

 

http://tdi-dog.org/

[Retired and Happy (Ken) 101]

We have had a couple of occasions, since we got a dog last April, to desensitize small visitors. Our Savannah is a sweet dog and protective of the family. She does display some aggression toward any one she does not know or has not seen much. One young girl who used to be a foster child of ours was deathly afraid of Savannah. We got her down by keeping Savannah on a leash and letting them get to know each other from a distance. We cautioned her to move somewhat slowly and not make any sudden moves. When she was sure (after several days) the dog was under tight leash control she ventured closer and by then Savannah was used to seeing her around. She eventually reached out to pet Savannah. That progressed to letting Savannah take a treat out of her hand, and when she went with us on vacation, she was the one who fed Savannah and wanted to get out in the morning and take Savannah for a walk. It took a while, both for the dog and the girl.

 

It worked much the same way with another girl who comes over with her mother occasionally. She is still a bit skittish since they don't see each other every day, but by the time she leaves, she is petting Savannah...cautiously.

 

Don't know if this helps, but that's our story and I'm sticking to it.  

[Cortezcapt (Derek) 156]

Instead of a rescue/shelter, look for someone or a place that specializes in therapy dogs or training therapy dogs. If you cant find anyone online try calling local hospitals, nursing homes, or rehab/therapy centers and asking for referrals.

I woukd ask them about coming to your house or another place your daughter is familiar and comfortable with (where shes on her turf). If thats not something you want to do you could ask about places that they go where you would be welcome to join.

I'm not sure in your area but around here there are a lot of people with therapy dogs (real therapy dogs trained to be gentle and wait to approach someone till invited, trained not to reactif someone moves or shys away) who do it out of the kindness of their hearts.

I woukd definitely research the person and dog ask for referrals first though, wouldnt want to scare here more.

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

 It took a while, both for the dog and the girl.

 

Desensitization works for dogs and people too. 

[twiceblessed....nacole 433]

That's where the "no pressure" part needs to come into play.

 

They key to desensitization is to keep below the stress/reaction level.  That might mean that to start, the person can only tolerate seeing a dog at a distance (possibly a very great distance).  Once the person is comfortable at that distance (which might take a good bit of time) you get closer, but not so close that they are uncomfortable.

 

Fearful reactions are tough to change and pushing the process can just end up making things worse.

 

You've said a lot of helpful things Mo... thank you.

 

 

I do not know if it is an option, but you guys should get a puppy.  Our second daughter was deathly afraid of all animals when she was 3 or 4.  So we got a puppy.  A cute little boxer pup.  At first she would climb the walls when we put him on the floor when she was in the room, but within a week or two she calmed down and is now our biggest animal lover.

 

Not an option, right now.  While my daughter claims that she wants a puppy, Mama doesn't want a dog right now because I know that I'm the one who will end up doing all the work to take care of it As someone who is not a huge "dog person", I might consider a dog... when my children are older and I can "force" them (haha) to help take care of the animal.  Additionally, our hope is to move out of Georgia in the next couple of years and I don't want the hassle of moving with a dog.   Plus, Mo's point was spot on... if she ends up being afraid of the pup, then I have to figure out what to do with the animal (and possibly our youngest as he could end up heartbroken over loosing the dog).  It was a good thought though, thank you...

 

 

One possiblity is to talk to someone at a local chapter of therapy dogs international.

They provide dogs (and other animals) with their owner/trainers opportuinties to visit hospitals, nursing homes, etc to let the patients interact with the dogs for therapy.  While what you describe is not really theirfocus, they probably know someone in their group who could work with you.  Their dogs are carefully screened and trained.  They have local chapters around the country, and there are other similar groups you can find with a search for therapy dogs. 

 

http://tdi-dog.org/

 

Thanks Leon... I sent an email to the coordinator.  Hopefully this will be a good resource for us.  Thank you again!

[ftwildernessguy 778]

I have owned dogs for over 50 years. Never had a biter in the bunch. One thing with people who have a fear of dogs, they seem to think the little dogs are safer. I will take my chances with a big dog over a little one anyday. There's a reason they are often known as ankle biters. My two, Buddy Dog the worlds greatest retriever and Murphy Doodle the gentle giant, wouldn't hurt a fly. Both are 85 pounders. Murphy loves kids and old people. He loves to go up to carriages aNd stick his giant head in to see babies, sometimes to the dismay of moms. His favorite kids are the 3 year olds. They are at his level. He goes up to them nose to nose and stares at them.

[BradyBzLyn...Mo 2,023]

My 3 are all completely different when it comes to kids.  None of them are completely comfortable around them, but then that's not unusual when it comes to border collies. None of them are biters, but because we know our dogs well, we're super cautious when it comes to any and all interactions.

 

Bz loves kids to itty bitty bits... IF they're sitting down and quiet.  If they're under about 8 years old and jumping and yelling and flailing (i.e., generally being kids), her herding dog "must. control. all. movement." kicks in. Because of this, she is not allowed near young kids and we very closely control ANY interactions with non-adults.  This is tricky, as she's the "cool looking" dog that everyone wants to meet. 

 

As for the black & whites...

 

Lyn will tolerate quiet, gentle kids (although you can tell she doesn't love it) but will run quickly away from active, scary kids... unless they're throwing her a ball or a frisbee, then she is their BFF X100.

 

Brady gets spooked if kids randomly run up to him, and he doesn't like anyone hugging him except for us.  But if kids are just kind of hanging around, he loves to sidle up to them and sneak the occasional lick on the cheek when they're not looking.

 

In all cases, if there's any doubt at all, we err on the side of caution.  Kids running up to my dogs is a huge deal, and I'll run them the other way, shout at them to "STOP" or run interference if I have to, to avoid this.  I don't know your kids, you don't know my dogs.  Please ask first, and not as your kid is running my way.

 

Last thing we need or want is for someone's kid to have a bad experience with one of our dogs that has lasting effects on the poor kid.  Or for one of our dogs to have a bad experience with kids and... ditto.

[red...Susan 37]

My little dog tries to climb on my head to get away from people. I am usually holding her. I also use a puppy pack pack for her and others protection. Not that she has ever bitten or growled at anyone.

[momof3kids-Yvonne 596]

My daughter did not discriminate when it came to her fear. Big, medium small, teeny tiny she was afraid of them all. She was even afraid of cats. We had one at the time to so that was fun.

[fladogfan aka Gretchen 259]

_{Then there is the kid, about 3 years old, who walked too close to a German Shepherd's food bowl.}

 

_{Bite on face!  Mom of little girl not happy, but did not make a big deal of that encounter.}

 

_{Didn't stop kid from approaching unknown dogs.}

 

_{Little kid was me 70 years ago and I grew up loving dogs and cats and eventually became a groomer.}

_{Mommy got me my first cat when I was 7.  I have had 19 cats, so far.   And 5 dogs.}

[twiceblessed....nacole 433]

My daughter did not discriminate when it came to her fear. Big, medium small, teeny tiny she was afraid of them all. She was even afraid of cats. We had one at the time to so that was fun.

 

Bailey does not discriminate either... big or small, she is fearful however, if a small dog is not jumping and is very calm then that's our best bet with her being calm and maybe brave enough to say hi or a very quick pet (I can only think of one or two occasions where this has happened).